[Ru'en Sane]

Mitch Ryder, on 22 July 2010 - 07:38 AM, said:

On my way to race weekend I was checking the Water Follies site and noticed that they have two days of qualifying on their schedule. The schedule looks very familiar to the one ran in Madison this year. Remember that debacle between a red boat and Da Commish? I guess it's a different day, different site, and a different set of interpretations. Be in the pits later today watching and reporting.

hey Mitch, haven't heard any reports from your T.C. race, what did you find? Just noticed something about the Seafair schedule, 2 days (Fri. & Sat) of qualifying and an a.m. session again. Sounds like the 'ol political flip-flop again with Da Commish & the Race Site. Do you think he talked with them after the other races?

I am all for more qualifying but how about each site having somewhat the same plan, then everyone knows what to expect. Makes sense to me

Like you said "it's a different day, different site, and a different set of interpretations"

SEAFAIR UNLIMITED HYDROPLANE SCHEDULE
Friday, August 6
8:30 a.m. – Gates Open
8:30 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session A
11:45 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 1
1:00 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
5:00 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 2
6:00 pm – Course Closes
Saturday, August 7
8:30 a.m. – Gates Open
9:30 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session B
10:50 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 3
12:30 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
2:40 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1A presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
3:00 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1B presented by Chohula Hot Sauce
6:00 p.m. – Course Closes
Sunday, August 8
7:30 a.m. – Gates Open
8:30 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Testing
10:00 a.m. – Opening Ceremonies
10:40 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2A presented by 76
11:00 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2B presented by Jack Daniel's
12:05 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3A presented by Tulalip Casino
12:25 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3B presented by Hyundai
2:45 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Provisional Heat presented by Oh Boy! Oberto
4:40 p.m. – Albert Lee Cup Unlimited Hydroplane Final
5:15 p.m. – Albert Lee Cup Awards Presentation

[Rick Beyer]

Two things:

- I love that they will have a provisional heat (or at least that one is scheduled). Of course, attrition can take a toll and it may not happen but at least there is an option.

- I remember the days when Seafair was a 4 day event (Thurs-Sun). We used to go all day on Thursday and Friday and had a blast.

Rick in Texas

[Aaron Lynch]

Once again the schedule is way too spread out. I realize they have a lot of other events going on but I really wish they wouldn't have four hours between Heat 3B and the final. I also wish they would only have the Friday qualifying but that's just my druthers.

[Lumpkins]

Aaron Lynch, on 30 July 2010 - 07:22 AM, said:

I also wish they would only have the Friday qualifying but that's just my druthers.

Why would you want just one day of qualifying? What would Saturday be for, testing all day? If you are testing to try and find speed, why not use it as a qualifying period also to improve your lane choice? Otherwise why put wear and tear on the boat and equipment. Would you rather see the three day event switch to a two day event? What is your rational?

[Aaron Lynch]

I feel that having the one day of qualifying makes for a better and more compact show. In my opinion it adds to the drama too, as teams well be looking to get on the water and lay down some hot laps. It will also give teams all day Saturday to work on their race setup before the Saturday afternoon heats. Two days of qualifying gets really repetitive and in the past most teams just used the final qualifying sessions to work on their timing runs, there was very little of teams moving up the qualifying ladder.

[Lumpkins]

Aaron Lynch, on 30 July 2010 - 01:30 PM, said:

I feel that having the one day of qualifying makes for a better and more compact show. In my opinion it adds to the drama too, as teams well be looking to get on the water and lay down some hot laps. It will also give teams all day Saturday to work on their race setup before the Saturday afternoon heats. Two days of qualifying gets really repetitive and in the past most teams just used the final qualifying sessions to work on their timing runs, there was very little of teams moving up the qualifying ladder.

Did you happen to catch Tri-Cities qualifying? If not your statement about teams moving up in qualifying is incorrect. Oberto went to #1 with a 162 and change to put Villwock at #2 and immediately following the Oberto run, the Spirit of Qatar went out and set a qualifying speed of 163 and change on his first lap to regain the #1 postion. Reminded me alot of the mid 80's to early 00's when teams used to bump each other late in the day from the pole.

How do you set a boat up without testing it on the water? If you are on the water and looking for speed, why not have it count toward qualifying to gain you those valuable points and a better lane choice. Sorry, but your logic does not compute.

[taylor228]

from the fan perspective it is a lot simpler to have qualifying and testing separate. let them test all they want on friday then each team has one qualifying run. With lane choices at stake it would be cool. If one of the favorites (u1,U96) isnt on their game they don't get to go out and redo until they get what they like. This just makes more chances for some of the other teams to come out and lay down a great lap and put some of the faster boats in outside lanes.

[Aaron Lynch]

I did happen to watch the qualifying for Tri-Cities. Here was the ladder after Friday:

1. U-96 Spirit of Qatar Dave Villwock 161.928

2. U-1 Oh Boy! Oberto Steve David 160.972

3. U-17 Miss Red Dot Nate Brown 157.199

4. U-25 Superior Racing Dr. Ken Muscatel 156.513

5. U-13 Spirit of Detroit Cal Phipps 156.296

6. U-21 Miss Albert Lee Appliance Brian Perkins 155.566

7. U-7 Graham Trucking J Michael Kelly 155.030

8. U-5 Formulaboats.com Jeff Bernard 153.861

9. U-100 Leland Unlimited Greg Hopp 152.219

10. U-37 Miss Peters & May Jon Zimmerman 150.763

11. U-22 Matrix Systems Mike Weber 136.622



And the ladder after Saturday:

U-96 Spirit of Qatar Dave Villwock 163.579 100
U-1 Oh Boy! Oberto Steve David 162.928 80
U-17 Miss Red Dot Nate Brown 157.199 70
U-7 Graham Trucking J Michael Kelly 157.062 60
U-25 Superior Racing Ken Muscatel 156.513 50
U-13 Spirit of Detroit Cal Phipps 156.296 40
U-21 Miss Albert Lee Appliance Brian Perkins 155.566 30
U-5 FormulaBoats.com Jeff Bernard 154.974 30
U-100 Fleury Auto & Truck Parts Greg Hopp 152.322 30
U-37 Miss Peters & May Jon Zimmerman 150.763 30
U-22 Matrix System Automotive Finishes Mike Webster 136.622 30
U-57 Formulaboats.com Mark Evans 132.747 30


As you can see, even with the extra qualifying on Saturday, while some teams improved their times the only team to move up the ladder after all was said and done was the U-7. As for my point about Saturday setup, I meant to say that the boats would be able to hit the water for testing, like carburation day before the Indy 500. I meant to say that it was just an oversight on my part. Mea Culpa

[Lumpkins]

Aaron Lynch, on 30 July 2010 - 04:49 PM, said:

As you can see, even with the extra qualifying on Saturday, while some teams improved their times the only team to move up the ladder after all was said and done was the U-7. As for my point about Saturday setup, I meant to say that the boats would be able to hit the water for testing, like carburation day before the Indy 500. I meant to say that it was just an oversight on my part. Mea Culpa

Do you think that boats would continually hit the water on Saturday risking damaging a boat or engine when their is nothing to gain from it in qualifying position or lane choice? Yeah you may gain a couple of miles an hour, but the lane choice would be far better, so why not equate the testing for setup and more speed with qualifying at the same time to make it worth their while.

Anyone else want to chime in on this?

[Mallard Mangler]

This years Columbia Cup I did witness two things.

1. Way more action on the river Friday and Saturday (Qalifying/Testing)

2. Classic battle between the 2 top boats for top spot in qualifying.

Like ole Lumpy said, that qualifying dual reminded me of the stuff I used to see in the 80's, 90's and early 2000's. Those day's when Villwock was in the Pico and Hanauer was in the Bud. Back and forth in qualifying all day. Classic times on the Columbia, and what a pleasure it was to see it all unfold on Saturday between Steve and Dave.

Good Shiat!!!!!!!!!

[Mitch Ryder]

Ru'en Sane

love that name

After the Tri-Cities it was tough to find Da Commish, after the tongue lashing and blame game in Detroit he may have holed himself up somewhere. As for the schedule I give up. Just hope for some good racing and everyone stays safe then we look towards...I guess Qatar but is it going to happen or not? QMSF needs to get it on their site if it is in fact going to happen. I need to know so I can get my airline ticket and accommodations taken care of.

[HydroDan]

Long wait between 3b and final. If cony gets cancelled like usual that will leave us only one boat race in the last 4.5 hours of the day. C'mon Seafair!?

Ru said:

hey Mitch, haven't heard any reports from your T.C. race, what did you find? Just noticed something about the Seafair schedule, 2 days (Fri. & Sat) of qualifying and an a.m. session again. Sounds like the 'ol political flip-flop again with Da Commish & the Race Site. Do you think he talked with them after the other races?

I am all for more qualifying but how about each site having somewhat the same plan, then everyone knows what to expect. Makes sense to me

Like you said "it's a different day, different site, and a different set of interpretations"

SEAFAIR UNLIMITED HYDROPLANE SCHEDULE
Friday, August 6
8:30 a.m. – Gates Open
8:30 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session A
11:45 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 1
1:00 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
5:00 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 2
6:00 pm – Course Closes
Saturday, August 7
8:30 a.m. – Gates Open
9:30 a.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session B
10:50 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 3
12:30 p.m. – Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
2:40 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1A presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
3:00 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1B presented by Chohula Hot Sauce
6:00 p.m. – Course Closes
Sunday, August 8
7:30 a.m. – Gates Open
8:30 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Testing
10:00 a.m. – Opening Ceremonies
10:40 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2A presented by 76
11:00 a.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2B presented by Jack Daniel's
12:05 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3A presented by Tulalip Casino
12:25 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3B presented by Hyundai
2:45 p.m. - Unlimited Hydroplane Provisional Heat presented by Oh Boy! Oberto
4:40 p.m. – Albert Lee Cup Unlimited Hydroplane Final
5:15 p.m. – Albert Lee Cup Awards Presentation

[Smith]

OK one more time ....


It is only Sea Fair in name sake now a' dayz it's AIR FAIR weekend


Boat racing is just a filler for the other events, crews are not allowed to work on boats while the AIR BOSSES are in control ...


It seems as though my progression in the sport of hydroplane racing has gone the opposite of most. I started out in the "Big Boats" and have found in my very short time of a little over 10 years in this sport that I am migrating more and more to my local regional races where every one there has come to race boats all weekend long ...

[Lon]

Here's another perspective on this scheduling issue and whether it's a boat race or airshow or ????


For the 3 days of scheduled Seafair race weekend activity, Friday 9.5 hrs., Sat 9.5 hrs., & Sunday 9 hrs = 28 Total hours

By general category,
Unlimiteds 9.75 hrs. *all these totals are estimates based on the schedule and some overlap each other
Unlimited Lights 7.75 hrs.
General Airshow 7.75 hrs.
Blue Angels 3.0 hrs.
Wakeboard show 7.75 hrs.
Music 3.75 hrs.

It raises a couple of questions...

1) Would people attend and pay to see only
a) The Unlimiteds
b The Unlimited Lights
c) The General Airshow
d) The Blue Angels
e) Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
f) Musical Entertainment, bands, etc...

2) What does it cost Seafair for each of these participants to appear and are any of them "self-sustaining"?
3) Which of these events could put on a show by themselves? and be profitable? (by profitable, I mean more in the context of self-supporting, also see the next question)
4) What % of the income generated from race weekend goes directly back into next year's event? ** This is a key question!!!

Some of these are hypothetical questions, some we already know the real answer to, and with Seafair in the situation it is in right now, some need to be seriously looked at. Most of us know what Seafair & it's history is based around, what people want to see, and it would appear that the focus may be shifting...

and of course, major sponsor financial support would obviously help, that would be the Seafair organization's responsibility to develop.

IMO, if we don't remember & support what the core of Seafair is (A Summer Celebration based around the Hydroplane Races), the hydroplane racing may be going the way of other race sites, gone!

Have fun!!

FYI. Here's the entire Seafair 3-day Event Schedule

2010 Schedule Albert Lee Cup & Boeing Air Show

Friday, Aug 6
8:30 a.m. Gates Open to the Public
8:30 a.m Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session A
9:30 a.m. Unlimited Lights Testing 1
9:30 a.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
10:15 a.m. Unlimited Lights Qualifying Session 1
11:00 a.m Boeing Air Show
11:45 a.m Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 1
12:00 p.m. Jared Clifton (Rock/Country/Roots)
12:30 p.m. Unlimited Lights Driver Autograph Session
1:00 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
1:00 p.m. U.S. Navy F-18 Demonstration
1:30 p.m. Fat Albert C-130 Demonstration
1:40 p.m. U.S. Navy Blue Angels Demonstration
2:30 p.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
2:30 p.m. TBD — Verizon Main Stage
2:30 p.m. Boeing Air Show
3:35 p.m. Airplane vs. Hydroplane Practice Session presented by Jack Daniel’s
3:50 p.m. Unlimited Lights Qualifying Session 2
4:00 p.m. Sugarsmacks (Soul & R&B Uptempo)
5:00 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 2
6:00 p.m. Hydroplane Race Course Closes

Saturday, August 7
8:30 a.m. Gates Open to the Public
8:30 a.m. Unlimited Lights Testing 2
9:30 a.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Testing Session B
9:30 a.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
10:50 a.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Qualifying Session 3
11:00 a.m. The Rockets (Blues)
11:30 a.m Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
12:10 a.m Unlimited Lights Heat 1A presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
12:15 p.m. U.S. Navy Band (Rock)
12:25 p.m. Unlimited Lights Heat 1B presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
12:30 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Driver Autograph Session
12:35 p.m Airplane vs. Hydroplane Race presented by Jack Daniel’s
1:00 p.m Unlimited Lights Driver Autograph Session
1:00 p.m. U.S. Navy F-18 Demonstration
1:20 p.m. Fat Albert C-130 Demonstration
1:30 p.m. U.S. Navy Blue Angels Demonstration
2:30 p.m. Fabulous Hammers (Rockabilly)
2:30 p.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
2:40 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1A presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
3:00 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 1B presented by Cholula Hot Sauce
3:20 p.m Unlimited Lights Heat 2A presented by Sicklesteel Crane
3:30 p.m. Latigo Lace (Indie Country)
3:35 p.m. Unlimited Lights Heat 2B presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
3:50 p.m. Boeing Air Show
5:00 p.m. Creme Tangerine (Beatles Cover Band)
6:00 p.m. Hydroplane Race Course Closes

Sunday, August 8
7:30 a.m. Gates Open to the Public
8:30 a.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Testing
9:30 a.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
9:30 a.m. Unlimited Lights Hydroplane Testing
10:00 a.m. Opening Ceremonies
10:10 a.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
10:10 a.m. Boeing Air Show
10:40 a.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2A presented by 76
11:00 a.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 2B
11:00 a.m Dance Group (Hip Hop)
11:20 a.m. Boeing Air Show
11:55 a.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience
12:05 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3A presented by Tulalip Resort Casino
12:15 p.m. The Rockets (Blues)
12:25 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Heat 3B presented by Hyundai
12:40 p.m. Airplane vs. Hydroplane Race presented by Jack Daniel’s
1:00 p.m. U.S. Navy F-18 Demonstration
1:20 p.m. Fat Albert C-130 Demonstration
1:30 p.m. U.S. Navy Blue Angels Demonstration
2:30 p.m. Hyperlite Wakeboard Experience Finals
2:30 p.m. Rae Solomon (Country/Rock)
2:45 p.m. Unlimited Hydroplane Provisional Heat presented by Oh Boy! Oberto
3:00 p.m. Unlimited Lights B-Main presented by Graham Trucking, Inc.
3:15 p.m. Boeing Air Show
4:00 p.m. All Mixed Up (80’s Cover Band)
4:20 p.m. Graham Trucking Cup Unlimited Lights Final
4:40 p.m. Albert Lee Cup Unlimited Hydroplane Final
5:15 p.m. Albert Lee Cup Awards Presentation
All times are approximate and subject to change

[Smith]

WOW ...

Thats a great job breaking it down, I guess it doesnt just feel considerably lopsided when waiting on airshow to get over. Thank you

I have a curiosity about how the numbers came out in E-ville after the cancellation of the races ...